Delayed Evolution Purpose

[Mayelesa]

119906 lol . . . I don't need to say anything because there is already 10 pages of 'evidence' which i asked the man to read. this child hurting my brain

 

So answer my question and that insulting me if u don't know

Keep it pg

[Cjlj]

119850 I just had a conversation with a guy ingame.

 

PRO's EXP is based on GEN 5 EXP.

the GEN 5 rate of EXP feels slower and thats always more practical in an MMO setting xD

 

But as for an explanation of how and why unevolved pokemon level up faster is really simple, and a bit of research on the EXP formula in gen 5 and base exp rates can sum it up.

 

Below is a conversation with said person earlier.

 

Shane, if this is the official explanation then this is an actual full on bug.

 

The "Base Experience Yield" is used to calculate how much experience a wild pokemon gives. It has never been used to calculate how much experience your pokemon requires to level up.

 

Here is the relevant Bulbapedia on how experience is calculated in Pokemon: https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Experience

 

The formulas in the first section are what is used to determine how much experience is required. The equation you use for a pokemon is determined by its "Leveling Rate Group" that is shown on a pokemon's Bulbapedia page. So all pokemon that are in the FAST group use the equation EXP=(4*level^3)/5. All pokemon in the medium fast group use EXP=level^3 and so on.

 

NO POKEMON CHANGE LEVELING RATE GROUPS WHEN THEY EVOLVE

 

To use your example of the Bulbasaur line, you can check the Bulbapedia pages for Bulbasaur, Ivysaur and Venusaur and see that they are all part of the "Medium Slow" group, so they all use the same formula to determine the experience required to reach a given level.

 

 

But what about experience gained? Does that change?

 

The experience you gain from a battle is shown in the Gain Formula section further down the Bulbapedia page for Experience.

 

Gen V used a different formula from all the other games because it scaled experience depending on the level difference between the pokemon in the battle. This game supposedly uses that formula so lets look at that.

 

• a is equal to...
  1 if the fainted Pokémon is wild
  1.5 if the fainted Pokémon is owned by a Trainer
  
• b is the base experience yield of the fainted Pokémon's species; values for the current Generation are listed here
  
• e is equal to...
  1.5 if the winning Pokémon is holding a Lucky Egg
  1 otherwise
  
• f is equal to...
  1.2 if the Pokémon has an Affection of two hearts or more
  1 otherwise
  
• L is the level of the fainted Pokémon
  
• Lp is the level of the victorious Pokémon
  
• p is equal to...
  1 if no Exp. Point Power (Pass PowerGen V or O-PowerGen VI) is active
  If Exp. Point Power [x] is active...
  0.5 for ↓↓↓, 0.66 for ↓↓, 0.8 for ↓, 1.2 for ↑, 1.5 for ↑↑, or 2 for ↑↑↑, S, or MAX
  
• s is equal to...
  In Generations II-V...
  If no Pokémon in the party is holding an Exp. Share...
  The number of Pokémon that participated in the battle and have not fainted
  If at least one Pokémon in the party is holding an Exp. Share...
  Twice the number of Pokémon that participated and have not fainted, when calculating the experience of a Pokémon that participated in battle
  Twice the number of Pokémon holding an Exp. Share, when calculating the experience of a Pokémon holding Exp. Share
  
• t is equal to...
  1 if the winning Pokémon's current owner is its Original Trainer
  1.5 if the Pokémon was gained in a domestic trade
  Generation IV+ only: 1.7 if the Pokémon was gained in an international trade

 

That's a lot of factors, but most of them are just stuff like exp share or the bonus you get if it's a traded pokemon.

 

The important ones are b, L and Lp.

 

L and Lp are the levels of the fainted pokemon and your pokemon. This is the part of the formula that scales experience based on if you are higher or lower level than the pokemon you defeat.

 

b is the base experience of the pokemon you defeat. It is not the base experience yield of your pokemon.

 

At no point does the base experience yield of your pokemon influence the calculation.

 

If we look at a case where the fighting pokemon are even level, and ignore all the modifiers like lucky egg, exp share and trading bonus, you can simplify the formula down to:

 

EXP=(a*b*L)/(5*s)+1

 

Or if you say that it's a 1v1 fight against an even level wild pokemon:

 

EXP=(b*L)/5+1

 

 

So lets take a case where we are using out level 50 Bulbasaur to kill a level 50 wild Rattata.

 

b is the base experience yield of the Rattata which from Bulbapedia we can see is 51.

L is the level of the wild pokemon, which in this case is 50.

All other variables are either 1 or cancel down to 1 so we can ignore them.

 

So for this fight the experience is EXP=(51*50)/5+1=511

 

This is true for any level 50 pokemon that defeats a wild level 50 Rattata. It is always 511 experience.

 

If instead you fight a level 50 Golduck, b would be 175 so EXP=(175*50)/5+1=1751

 

This is true for any level 50 pokemon that defeats a wild level 50 Golduck. It is always 1751 experience.

 

There is one other variable i haven't talked about here. In Gen VI only, pokemon that are at or past the level that they can evolve get a 20% bonus to experience gain. This is not scaled to the pokemon's base experience yield and it is only in Gen VI, so this doesn't account for the huge difference in experience requirement seen from evolving pokemon in PRO.

 

 

So in summry:

If you intended to copy Gen V's experience calculations, there is a huge error in the calculations somewhere. Base experience yield of your Pokemon does not influence your experience required or experienced gained in Gen V or any main series pokemon games. You need to look at the code for how you calculate XP in this game because something has gone horribly wrong.

[Kxrizmuh]

I see why people don't like to evolve their pokemon early for moves and easier leveling purposes, but does this not also mean that the pokemon would be losing out on valuable stats as well?

 

Regards,

Kxrizmuh

[Mayelesa]

119983 I see why people don't like to evolve their pokemon early for moves and easier leveling purposes, but does this not also mean that the pokemon would be losing out on valuable stats as well?

 

Regards,

Kxrizmuh

no, you will get all same stat when u evoluted it

[Cjlj]

119983 I see why people don't like to evolve their pokemon early for moves and easier leveling purposes, but does this not also mean that the pokemon would be losing out on valuable stats as well?

 

Regards,

Kxrizmuh

 

In the short term yes, in the long term no. A pokemon's stats are calculated by (level/100)*(2*BASE+IV+EV/4+5). When you evolve a pokemon the base stats change and are updated to use the evolved form's bases stats, and that usually gives a nice bump in stats. It doesn't matter when you evolve it though. If you evolve a Growlithe at level 10 it will have the same stats as one you evolve at level 50 as long as they are both the same level.

[Kxrizmuh]

119989 In the short term yes, in the long term no. A pokemon's stats are calculated by (level/100)*(2*BASE+IV+EV/4+5). When you evolve a pokemon the base stats change and are updated to use the evolved form's bases stats, and that usually gives a nice bump in stats. It doesn't matter when you evolve it though. If you evolve a Growlithe at level 10 it will have the same stats as one you evolve at level 50 as long as they are both the same level.

 

I looked this up on the internet and you are very correct. Thank you for the speedy response.

 

Regards,

Kxrizmuh

[Starlight]

119972It has never been used to calculate how much that pokemon gets.

 

rather than "gets", I suggest "need to level up" instead.

[Crimefridge]

PRO's EXP is based on GEN 5 EXP.

the GEN 5 rate of EXP feels slower and thats always more practical in an MMO setting xD

 

Again, we need a source, because bulbapedia, which I've heard other GMs saying the same exact thing, does not say anything about this system nor does it have "base exp rates" (except for the 6 group system), only the exp gained from KOing them.

 

ONE LINK. One single link would make this whole discussion go away. One source. But we've gotten nothing."Look at bulbapedia" WE DID! Just give us something, And don't link to the Bulbapedia exp page, because that had nothing to support it either!

 

Are you guys even going to change this if it's found out to not be from Gen V but some programming added in because they somehow thought "base exp yield = exp required for level 2" or something?

 

Because whenever I ask for numbers they tell me to look at some page of bulbasaur and the only exp number is base exp yield, which is for when you KO them...

 

As a matter of fact, the developer in charge of the exp rates very well seems to have followed "base exp yield" based on the exp required trends:

 

Squirtle : 63

Wartortle : 142

Blastoise : 239

 

Growlithe: 70

Arcanine: 194

 

Now while it would be hilarious to find out the developer in charge of exp thought exp yield meant something for the base exp of pokemon, it would also be horrifyingly disturbing in terms of wondering what other mechanics weren't implemented accurately.

[Cjlj]

In case anyone still doesn't believe me, i evolved a Growlithe to Arcanine using a Fire Stone in Black 2.

 

 

Same XP required for both forms because they are both in the Slow leveling group.

 

Just to verify that the equations i referenced above are correct, we can use these values to verify the equations.

 

Growlithe and Arcanine are part of the "Slow" leveling group.

 

The equation to calculate total EXP required to reach level n for the "Slow" group is:

 

EXP=(5*n^3)/4

 

So for level 13:

EXP=(5*13^3)/4=2746.25

 

For level 14:

EXP=(5*14^3)/4=3430

 

So XP required to get from 13 to 14 is:

3430-2746=684

 

If you check the screenshot of Black 2 you can confirm that this is correct.

 

For reference, the base experience yield for Growlithe is 70, and for Arcanine it's 194. However, this only affects how much experience you get for killing a Growlithe or Arcanine in the wild or against an NPC trainer. This number does not affect the experience of YOUR Growlithe and Arcanine in any way.

 

PRO does not follow the Gen 5 XP formulas. Go and catch a Growlithe then give it a fire stone and see for yourself. There is either a bug with the code or one of the developers misinterpreted the equations the pokemon games use when implementing it.

[Xpsy]

120097 In case anyone still doesn't believe me, i evolved a Growlithe to Arcanine using a Fire Stone in Black 2.

 

 

Same XP required for both forms because they are both in the Slow leveling group.

 

Just to verify that the equations i referenced above are correct, we can use these values to verify the equations.

 

Growlithe and Arcanine are part of the "Slow" leveling group.

 

The equation to calculate total EXP required to reach level n for the "Slow" group is:

 

EXP=(5*n^3)/4

 

So for level 13:

EXP=(5*13^3)/4=2746.25

 

For level 14:

EXP=(5*14^3)/4=3430

 

So XP required to get from 13 to 14 is:

3430-2746=684

 

If you check the screenshot of Black 2 you can confirm that this is correct.

 

For reference, the base experience yield for Growlithe is 70, and for Arcanine it's 194. However, this only affects how much experience you get for killing a Growlithe or Arcanine in the wild or against an NPC trainer. This number does not affect the experience of YOUR Growlithe and Arcanine in any way.

 

PRO does not follow the Gen 5 XP formulas. Go and catch a Growlithe then give it a fire stone and see for yourself. There is either a bug with the code or one of the developers misinterpreted the equations the pokemno games use when implementing it.

If this gets fixed, then PRO will only become a better game because of it. I agree grind is inherent in MMO's, but Pokemon was already a grind if you don't have thing like egg exp or traded exp and the like. All we have here mostly are wild pokemon battles to level up with and that process should not take forever. Imagine repeating it over and over if you were a competitive player simply because you wanted to add a new mon to your roster.

 

ON top of that, just the fact that there is no breeding alone (which I'm fine with) means there is addtional grind when trying to get a good natured/IV mon.