Delayed Evolution Purpose

[Jinga]

You're confusing "hard" with "time consuming" again. One shotting Golducks in a cave to level up isn't hard, it's just time consuming.

 

But again, if as you say the point of the increased experience requirements is to make it so people at end game can't easily level whatever pokemon they want to 100, then the current system is a complete failure even at that. Anyone who has beaten the story is just going to level any extra pokemon they want in their unevolved forms. The system only harms new players who don't know that they shouldn't evolve their pokemon. If you want to make it hard to get to 100 then tweak the exp curve so it takes a lot more exp at higher levels.

 

Then you just haven't played the game more. I still evolve Pokemon whenever I want and yet I don't have problem till level 95 and even after that, it isn't so hard even for evolved or unevolved form. This feature was meant for the end game, while not increasing the exp gain for evolved Pokemon, decrease the amount for unevolved forms, so the grind would be lowered and the end game won't be "Time consuming" grinding only.

The current system only makes it so the optimal strategy is to dump your main team in the PC and quickly grind up unevolved replacements once you have unlocked the region's map.

 

No, the system makes to to hunt/trade for better IV/natured Pokemon for the end game. Unless you are entering the battle scene, you don't need to keep your Pokemon unevolved Pokemon if you can use them properly to beat NPC's.

[Jinga]

117936

...if you don't like the grind then you shouldn't even play.

 

The problem isn't the grind itself, the problem is the pointless mechanic that penalizes evolving far too much. Again, evolving say Squirtle twice means you have to grind 9 times as much.

 

That's not some "oh you're anti-grind, why are you playing an MMO then" argument you can make.

 

That's like saying shooting yourself in both feet and then running a marathon is fun.

 

If the devs want to keep this asinine, pointless mechanic, they could at least offer a way to unevolve pokemon. Hell, you could even make it a paid service since milking money is what this seems to be about anyways.

 

The "absolutes" that I've heard from the dev team about this game mortifies me.

 

"Absolutely no breeding, no discussion, never happening."

 

The reason is to increase grind and therefore make more money.

 

But they could easily incorporate a certain other MMOs breeding system where both parents die, they could then make products you can buy with donations that aid the process (or are even required), and they can make breeding prohibitively expensive with in game currency and they would still win.

 

It takes a massive lack of imagination and basic mass communication ability to write off the most desired feature in the game like it's unattainable because of the bottom line. "It'll ruin pokemon hunting!" then design it so it doesn't. "It'll lose us money," then make it so you gain even more money over time than without.

 

The excuses I hear for decisions is baffling (why is Shadow Ball TM, a competitively heavily relevant TM, subjected to being limited availability only during Halloween? [it's now available for the Celadon daily quest by chance at least]) and instead of resolving the problems that are actual problems through user feedback, the responses we hear are "it's never, ever ever ever going to happen" like some stubborn kid.

 

Now I'm not some idiot who doesn't understand the level of programming required to implement the breeding system. But to claim that the problem is the long term server sustainability, pokemon inflation, the killing of the economy, or whatever such nonsense gets said is far too short-sighted to really be worth listening to.

 

I don't think anyone is going to reflect back on "oh I'm so glad the server made me keep my pokemon unevolved the entire game" and think of it fondly as a wonderful game mechanic that allowed for an immersive user experience.

 

And that's my entire issue so far with the server. It's like beating your head against a wall against tradition because "it just is" and it's clearly not good enough for the incoming user base. Now if you guys want to fail basic mass comm on your business (whether it's non-profit or not, it's still a business) where user feedback has dictated a current issue that's annoying / frustrating your user base, by all means, instead of being the CostCo of Pokemon MMOs you can be the Wal-Mart.

 

Breeding would kill hunting and everyone will have perfect 6x31 ivs, then the game just would become like Pokemmo (which was totally horrible).

It takes a massive lack of imagination and basic mass communication ability to write off the most desired feature in the game like it's unattainable because of the bottom line. "It'll ruin pokemon hunting!" then design it so it doesn't. "It'll lose us money," then make it so you gain even more money over time than without.

 

If you are going to add breeding, then one day it will catch up and just kill hunting, no matter what idea you try, since those breeded Pokemon will keep moving into the hands of people who are here for battling, once they stop playing, they would sell their Pokemon to others who are active and so, that makes for a new casual user never to catch up to them at all, but by this way, one can get lucky, get a rare shiny or epic and sell it to make cash and then build a team.

 

They thought about breeding, they din't like, so there would be no breeding. There are other games which has breeding, if you don't like this, you can stay in that.

I don't think anyone is going to reflect back on "oh I'm so glad the server made me keep my pokemon unevolved the entire game" and think of it fondly as a wonderful game mechanic that allowed for an immersive user experience.

 

If you aren't looking for end game, then you don't need to keep your Pokemon unevolved, simple.

But they could easily incorporate a certain other MMOs breeding system where both parents die, they could then make products you can buy with donations that aid the process (or are even required), and they can make breeding prohibitively expensive with in game currency and they would still win.

 

That is what destroyed their game, breeding. Even if it is expensive, once the game gets a stable economy, that won't matter and you will be seeing the same 6x31 ivs everywhere. You are just here for sometime and then probably will go away, the incoming people who want to stay here would suffer the consequences. So, keep your breeding to yourself.

[Jinga]

After reading this entire thread, I decided to just delete the game. Evolving Pokemon is my personal favorite part of the Pokemon franchise. As many other users have echoed, punishing players for evolving their Pokemon is ridiculous. It has nothing to do about making the game easier. The game IS easier. But how? Well just don't evolve your Pokemon of course! .... This may work for Ash Ketchum fans(yuck), but not for a large portion of the Pokemon community.

 

The argument that "nobody is forcing you to not evolve your Pokemon!" is blind and ignorant. That is very easy for the person who is just in love with their basic Pokemon. They don't have to deal with 9x exp(believe i read 9x in this thread?) requirements. No one should be punished for raising their Pokemon the way that they want to.

 

Unfortunately, the defenders of these poor game design decisions blindly defend it with "If you don't like it then you don't have to play!". Or "Not every Pokemon game has to be the same!". Pretty sad really.

 

P.S. The term is Evolve your Pokemon. It is NOT Evolute. LOL

 

It is not 9x, LOL. It is just a little, like 1.3x I believe (not sure about this too, can be even less), which isn't a lot. If you are a casual, then it will be a little time consuming, but not much, but it sure isn't game changer since you can easily level those evolved Pokemon to 99 easily in Cerulean cave (you can use rare candies for 100). I have evolved many Pokemon at the given evolve prompt and it is now even easy to level up as Cerulean cave was buffed. You are also blind and arrogant to believe the system is forcing on you, while it isn't, simple.

 

The DEV's changed it to fit this for end game, if you aren't here for end game then you don't need to worry about this change, at all.

[Jinga]

118359 Evolving has the side benefit of making some Pokemon more tolerable to level, and keeping up with the balance status quo of the games. If you want it to take longer or to be a grind, just triple xp requirements or something. It's much easier to explain than evolutions suddenly being miserable to level (Which again is not explained to new players anywhere)

 

grinds are a side-effect of mmos, not the core mechanic. if this mmo doesn't charge a subscription fee, why are you forced to spend so much time in it to get anywhere? why not make it a place you want to be because it's fun and enjoyable, rather than because you have to. For the record I do like a bunch of the changes to gym leaders even if misty with ice type attacks was a nasty surprise, put more things like that in rather than "You must spend this much time doing nothing to ride" signs

 

This is because in handhelds, NPC's are mostly at level of 70 or 80, and the game could be completed in 2 to 3 days and once you are bored, you go play another game. While this game is made not only for the storyline but for also end game, hencewhy the change.

 

Pokemon only has grinding and breeding (and maybe contests but there was no particular effort on those to be considered), they removed the second, so they need to balance out the grind to fit the end game too.

[Crimefridge]

It is not 9x, LOL. It is just a little, like 1.3x I believe (not sure about this too, can be even less), which isn't a lot.

 

I tested on Growlithe to Arcanine > 3x exp required.

 

My level 54 Abra at one point has the exact same base exp as my level 43 Graveler. That isn't 1.3x. And before anybody says "exp groups", Abra and Graveler both belong to the exact same group: Medium-Slow. The level distance is only increasing, which is why I mentioned 20+ levels of difference with ONE evolve. Now think about how much I'd lose with two?

 

If it was 1.3x exp, I would be still irritated but probably could deal with that. But it's clearly not.

[Cjlj]

119139

I tested on Growlithe to Arcanine > 3x exp required.

 

My level 54 Abra at one point has the exact same base exp as my level 43 Graveler. That isn't 1.3x. And before anybody says "exp groups", Abra and Graveler both belong to the exact same group: Medium-Slow. The level distance is only increasing, which is why I mentioned 20+ levels of difference with ONE evolve. Now think about how much I'd lose with two?

 

If it was 1.3x exp, I would be still irritated but probably could deal with that. But it's clearly not.

 

Here are some screenshots i took today of the XP required before and after evolving a few pokemon.

 

https://i.imgur.com/IsoJXRN.png

 

So it looks like it's more complicated than just a 3x multipler across the board.

 

I need to do more testing, but my best guess is that it's either different multipliers for different leveling rate groups, or evolved pokemon are on a different curve so the difference changes depending on level.

 

I have a bunch of pokemon from different leveling rate groups around 50 now so when i get a chance i'll try to compare different breeds at the same level.

 

The DEV's changed it to fit this for end game, if you aren't here for end game then you don't need to worry about this change, at all.

 

Can you explain clearly what you mean by "devs changed it to fit this for end game"? What change do you think they made and for what reason?

 

If you think they made it take more experience to level pokemon so it's harder to get to level 100, you are wrong. People who are training pokemon for end game just don't evolve their pokemon to avoid the extra grind because they aren't stupid.

 

If you think they reduced the experience cost of unevolved pokemon so people at end game can easily level up pokemon, you are wrong. It is an xp penalty applied to evolved pokemon, not an xp bonus to unevolved pokemon.

 

If you think the increased xp curve only kicks in at high level so it doesn't affect people working through the gyms, you are wrong. I tested it at level 13 on a Caterpie and the xp penalty for evolving definitely occurs at that level. Without any evidence to the contrary i have to assume it takes place at all levels. It definitely affects people working through the story.

 

 

So what exactly do you mean by "devs changed it to fit this for end game"?

[Guest UnknownUser11]

I just had a conversation with a guy ingame.

 

PRO's EXP is based on GEN 5 EXP.

the GEN 5 rate of EXP feels slower and thats always more practical in an MMO setting xD

 

But as for an explanation of how and why unevolved pokemon level up faster is really simple, and a bit of research on the EXP formula in gen 5 and base exp rates can sum it up.

 

Below is a conversation with said person earlier.

[Mayelesa]

119850 I just had a conversation with a guy ingame.

 

PRO's EXP is based on GEN 5 EXP.

the GEN 5 rate of EXP feels slower and thats always more practical in an MMO setting xD

 

But as for an explanation of how and why unevolved pokemon level up faster is really simple, and a bit of research on the EXP formula in gen 5 and base exp rates can sum it up.

 

Below is a conversation with said person earlier.

 

Sr Shane, but I see this guy don't put any effort fot his agurment :Proud:

And this system is right and need to be :Cool: if wanna change, he must to put more reasreach and effort rather than talk nothing

[Mayelesa]

Can I ask, what the purpose for say the penety of system? If you choice evolution, you will take more time to gain lv right? So the penaty of the guys who want evolution is waste or time consuming to lv up?

Thus, what your purpose for wanna to lvup evolution pokemon? Beware that evolution pokemon has lower lv than not-evolution pokemon, but it still stronger than by move and stat

So what the problem in there? And plz answer for all my question. Thank you so much :Heart:

 

p/s: did u know have daycare for lvup, and you will not waster time?

[Robert69]

lol . . . I don't need to say anything because there is already 10 pages of 'evidence' which i asked the man to read. this child hurting my brain