Delayed Evolution Purpose

[Cjlj]

I'm going to pre-empt this response because i know someone is going to make it.

 

"But this game isn't meant to be exactly like the Nintendo games. MMOs are meant to be grindy. Get good noob."<i></i>

 

First of all, a developer said on the previous page that the experience in this game is meant to follow the Gen 5 formula. As i have demonstrated in the previous posts, this is not the case. Either through a misinterpretation of Gen 5 XP formulas or a mistake in the code, the PRO experience does not currently work like Gen 5 as it is supposed to.

 

Secondly, MMOs are not inherently grindy. The reason so many are is for two reasons. First, it is basically impossible for developers to create content as fast as players consume it. To keep people paying subscription fees or buying stuff from the cash shop in F2P MMOs, developers make the game grindy so players don't finish all the content in 2 days then quit. The other reason is to create value through opportunity cost. Currently, if someone has a level 100 shiny Charizard with perfect IVs and nature that's really rare and valuable. It has value because it takes a long time to catch a perfect IV shiny Charmander, and it takes time to level up to 100. If everyone could generate a lvl 100 shiny Charizard at the push of a button. All pokemon would be worthless and we might as well just play Pokemon Showdown instead. However, in an ideal world you would level that Charmander by fun engaging content, such as fighting difficult trainers, rather than just 1 shotting wild pokemon for hours on end.

 

That said, i accept that there might be good reasons to make it slower to get to level 100 in this game than the mainline Nintendo games. For instance, if you don't want people to be able to quickly level every pokemon to 100 for end game content so there is some variety between what pokemon people use. However, varying XP requirements based on XP yield is a terrible way to do this. Lets go back to the Growlithe. Say i catch a Growlithe with a good IV spread and good nature and want to level it to 100. What am i going to do? The answer is level it to 100 as Growlithe then give it a Fire Stone to evolve it to Arcanine. Arcanine takes about 3 times more XP to level, so i avoid the grind by keeping it as a Growlithe. If the point of this system was to make it take longer for people to get pokemon to level 100 then it failed completely because i just avoided the increased XP cost by keeping it as a Growlithe.

 

If you want to make it harder to get to level 100 then you should just change the formulas used to determine the XP curve across the board. For instance, change the Slow group formula from EXP=(5*n^3)/4 to EXP=(5*n^3)/2. By making that simple change you doubled the XP Growlithe and Arcanine require to get to 100, and you can't avoid the grind by keeping it as a Growlithe until level 100.

 

I'm not arguing to make the game easier, and i'm not saying that everything has to be identical to the main Nintendo series. I just want a system that makes sense and serves a purpose, because the current system does neither.

[Cjlj]

I did some more testing. The XP yield from wild pokemon seems to be based off Gen 4 base yield values.

 

The equation to calculate XP yield from a wild pokemon seems to be based off Gen V as i outlined above, but it's rounded up and multiplied by 7 for some reason. I don't know why but maybe it's a clue that can be used for reverse engineering XP requirement values. it's multiplied by level/2 rounded down.

 

I haven't had a chance to check how XP distribution between multiple pokemon works yet, unfortunately.

 

Using Gen IV base yield can lead to some really funky stuff though. For instance, Happiny, Chansey and Blissey all have a base yield of 255 (the joint highest in the game along with Arceus). That means that evolving that line shouldn't increase the XP requirement in PRO. Does anyone have one of these pokemon to test it out?

 

I also wonder what that means for base XP yield for Gen V and VI pokemon, since they are on a different scale.

[Eoxsa]

Fixed levelling would also be a very healthy addition to the game, because if levelling a pokemon takes 3 straight hours in Seafoam everyone is just going to level the "Strongest" dudes and we'll wind up with Smogon x100 for the endgame.

[Bluetaco]

Glad im not the only one seing the exp problem, its making the game frustrating.

 

So i cheked my gba games pkmn lf and pkmn saphire, in both im on hall of fame with pokes in lvl 53 - 59.

here in lvl 50 and i couldnt beat sabrina xD had to try a lot and with revives and potions, some times dmg from npc pokes are unbalanced, like literally an lvl 21 patrat fainted my lvl 41 steelix with two normal moves... mobs hit hard, im not saying that i want an easy game.. i just want some balance.

Same for grinding zones, im calculating sabrina has like lvl 55 pokes it seems, so the only good grinding zone is seafoam with lvl 33 pokemon (for spatk, spd, and spdef evs) the atk ones i think is near fuchsia city with lvl 30. Again is not impossible but its so anoying and frustrating.

so what happens if u loose a lot vs a gym leader? u wont get any exp, that means that u will fall behind a lot, or at least will be a frustrating time for u, cuz grindig zones have low rewards but high risk (a lvl 31 poke can faint with a super efective move or 2 a lvl 50 one).

just my opinion dont want to be mean but the game is so good, it only needs a little balance (some low lvl pokes hit too hard, and that isnt normal and the exp problem aswell) feel free to correct me :3

:confused:

[Xpsy]

Bumping for visibility.

[Xpsy]

In no pokemon game has a mons exp rate to level up ever changed. I've checked all the main games. Hell even Gen 1 worked the same way such as having pokemon fit into exp groups.

[Robert69]

well the dev clearly didn't read the thread based on his reply and the speed in which he made his response, literally 1-2 minutes after i pmed him.

 

CJLJ and many others made some great posts detailing exactly what is wrong with the XP system. but still no real reply, explaining if this was intended or not.

[Mayelesa]

122063 well the dev clearly didn't read the thread based on his reply and the speed in which he made his response, literally 1-2 minutes after i pmed him.

 

CJLJ and many others made some great posts detailing exactly what is wrong with the XP system. but still no real reply, explaining if this was intended or not.

 

And u ignore my reply too :etc: or you cannot answer because you know what I will reply?

Can I ask, what the purpose for say the penety of system? If you choice evolution, you will take more time to gain lv right? So the penaty of the guys who want evolution is waste or time consuming to lv up? -> Time consuming?

Thus, what your purpose for wanna change this system? Beware that evolution pokemon has lower lv than not-evolution pokemon, but it still stronger than by move and stat --> For story process? for lvup faster? for same as original game? and so on?

So what the problem in there? And plz answer for all my question. Thank you so much :Heart:

 

p/s: did u know have daycare for lvup, and you will not waster time?

119906 lol . . . I don't need to say anything because there is already 10 pages of 'evidence' which i asked the man to read. this child hurting my brain

So answer my question and that insulting me if u don't know

Keep it pg

If reason is about the story process, talk in here: https://pokemonrevolution.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=20010

P/s: look your sign can know what u think about people :n: That's not nice

[Cjlj]

And u ignore my reply too :etc: or you cannot answer because you know what I will reply?

Can I ask, what the purpose for say the penety of system? If you choice evolution, you will take more time to gain lv right? So the penaty of the guys who want evolution is waste or time consuming to lv up? -> Time consuming?

Thus, what your purpose for wanna change this system? Beware that evolution pokemon has lower lv than not-evolution pokemon, but it still stronger than by move and stat --> For story process? for lvup faster? for same as original game? and so on?

So what the problem in there? And plz answer for all my question. Thank you so much :Heart:

 

p/s: did u know have daycare for lvup, and you will not waster time?

119906 lol . . . I don't need to say anything because there is already 10 pages of 'evidence' which i asked the man to read. this child hurting my brain

So answer my question and that insulting me if u don't know

Keep it pg

If reason is about the story process, talk in here: https://pokemonrevolution.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=20010

P/s: look your sign can know what u think about people :n: That's not nice

 

Your english isn't very good so it's hard to understand what you are asking.

 

I think you're asking what my motive is for wanting it to be changed? Do i want to make it easier to level? Do i just want it to be exactly the same as the Nintendo games? No.

 

[glow=red]All i want is a system that makes sense.[/glow]

 

Over the last couple of days i have been testing how experience works in this game so now i can give you an actual example of why the current system is stupid.

 

Here is the scenario: I really like Nidoking. Nidoking is a good pokemon that has good stats and can learn lots of moves. I start playing PRO and i catch a Nidoran M from Route 22. I use this Nidoran while playing through Kanto. I evolve it to Nidorino at 16 because gyms are hard and i need the extra stats. I evolve it to Nidoking after 43 once i have Poison Jab because the later gyms are really hard and i really need the extra stats. By the time i beat all the gyms in Kanto my Nidoking is now 75.

 

Now i find out that there are bosses in PRO that are really hard and require a team of level 100 pokemon to fight. I want Nidoking on my team so i want to get him to 100.

 

After some testing, i have confirmed that PRO does not have levelling groups like all normal pokemon games. They all use the same base curve, but the amount of XP required is then multiplied by the pokemon's base XP yield. For some reason it uses the base XP yield that is listed first on the pokemon's Bulbapedia page, so since Nidoran and Nidoking are from Gen 1 it uses the gen 1 values. In Gen 1 Nidoran M's base XP yield is 60, and Nidoking's is 195. That means Nidoking takes x3.25 more XP to level up than Nidoran M.

 

The amount of experience it takes to reach level 75 on a Nidoking is ~3972000. To reach 100 it takes ~24092000. So to get from 75 to 100 on my Nidoking i need ~20120000 XP.

 

Alternatively, i could catch a fresh level 5 Nidoran M. To get this Nidoran M to 100 would take ~7413000 XP.

 

The amount of XP required to get a fresh level 5 Nidoran to 100 is 2.7 times less than it would take to level my Nidoking that is already level 75.

 

In the time it takes to level the Nidoking from 75 to 100, you could level a Nidoran, Abra and Shinx to 100 and have a Nidoking, Alakazam and Luxray.

 

Do you not see why this is stupid? Who in their right mind would design a system where it is several times easier to level a pokemon from level 1-100 than it is to level the pokemon you already have at level 75?

 

If you think leveling should take longer in PRO than the Nintendo games, or if you think PRO is currently too grindy and they should make it easier, it doesn't matter. I think everyone can agree that a system where it's faster to level a pokemon to 100 from level 5, compared to from level 75 is broken and needs to be fixed.

[Guest NOSLEEP]

Devs are so fcking retarded if they want evolved pokemon to require more exp to level. Honestly seems like the fckwits couldn't do the math or don't understand how the game works and have decided to keep it rather than admitting they're wrong and improving the game. Well done.