Lets talk together about Staff & Player relationship !

[Olker]

1 hour ago, princekashyap said:

Why game is not available in Google Playstore? I think it will grow faster if available in Playstore. 

That would probably bring PRO legal issues with Nintendo, and most likely be closed. Similar to Belz's patreon case.

[Belzebel]

11 hours ago, Shinohara said:

Hello, @Belzebel.

I will divide this post in different parts in order to provide as much clarification as possible, pre-announcing that it will include details in order to support the statements that will be done.

 

 

Unfortunately, the way ban and appeal works is something you have never been able to grasp despite I have tried to explain you them several times, both when you were within the staff team and as well outside.

The problem starts in the first place when you say "quick to ban", making it sound in a bad thing, for the simple reason that you have no clue about how bans works despite I explained you several times every time you were getting punished for something and even in other moments.

 

Warning exists, but there are few variables that affect how and if they are issued. I have already explained you them several times, but lets mention some here:

1. The rule that is being violated:
   • For Chat Infraction & Trade Infraction, if sending a warning here or not is totally and entirely situational cause there are both big and small infractions in both.
     
     Chat Infraction
     Making the example of something small, like it can be a little spam, we generally just issue a warning if the user has never broken rules before. If the user has already broken rules before, and therefore this means he already is familiar with rules and specially already received a warning for something else before, we issue a mute ban.
     For something heavier, for example involving racism like it can be «"Ehi you all gentleman should die"» or, making a non-racist example, something like «"you [hecking] retard go [hecking] die you [wonderful person]», which is obviously way more serious and unacceptable, we just issue a mute ban directly without any previous warning.
     The reason why there is a division between the severity of the infraction is obvious, where one is a little thing that does not damage anyone or, if it does, is something small, and the other (racist/insult, etc) is something that affect the whole community and damages it.
     
     Trade Infraction
     Exactly like Chat Infractions, even here there are infractions more serious than others.
     A small Trade Infraction could simply be a user advertising a pokemon wrongly (eexample saying he sell a pokemon saying it's all +20 when in reality its stats are below), while a bigger one is a succesful scam.
     First is a warning, remembering the fact that warning are issued only if you have not received any punishment before, cause if you did then you should have familiarized with the rules and also have already received a warn, while the second instead (succesful scam) is a direct trade ban for X days.
     Even here, the reason is simple. in the second one is a real damage to a player that sometimes cannot even be reversed if not reported on time/fast and therefore deserves a direct trade ban while in the first a direct trade ban is not needed (remembering the previous punishment stuff) as the damage is something really small.
     
      
   • GM Infraction
     Giving that GM handles the most serious infractions possible, warnings before ban do not exists here or are really really rare.
     Some of the serious things GM handle are: Real Money Trading (accounts, item, pokemons being sold or bought for real-life money which also harm and destroy economy), Unauthorized Software (usage of illegal software to gain unfair advantage over other players and also harm and destroy the economy), Bug Abusing (abusing of possible bugs to gain unfair advantage over other users and destroy economy, there was a issue in 2018 were people could duplicate Coin Capsule for example).
     
     None of these things deserve a warn before ban.
     Imagine someone duplicating Coin Capsules (like happened in 2018) on purpose and starting to sell them.
     Going there and telling them «"Ehi, saw you are bug abusing and selling the products of it, can you just stop please?"» after the user gained millions after selling bug abused things.
     It would be incredibly stupid and totally unfair toward the honest players.
     
     Same goes toward someone who is using Macro (unauthorized software) to farm money or pokemon for hours while being outside of home.
     What do you tell them? «"Ehi, sorry for the disturb, saw you using macro and farmed 3 millions and also caught a epic charmander while you were sleeping, just don't do it anymore, ok?"»
     It would be totally unfair toward honest players who farmed hard to obtain those things.
     
     No need to say but if the users in the appeal are honest and cooperative, and the damage they brought/did can be removed (example they farmed 5 millions pokedollars with macro, and they still have them so they can be removed) then we will obviously offer a second chance if that's their first infractions.
     
      
2. The punishment history of the user:
   • If someone has already previous punishments received, the user should be already well aware of the rules and have familiarized with them, specially since they should have received already a warn or got told by staff to familiarized with rules during the appeal.
     I mean, rules in general should be read before playing if we would like to be technically true, but we are anyway kind enough to issue just a warning at the first infraction and remind users to familiarize with them.
      

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Some appeals mainly take long time for two (or three, although third is really small) reasons:

• Infraction is a really problematic and big one (for example Account Hacks and RMT)
• User has a really long punishment history, on multiple platform (game, official pro discord, official tournaments discord + other stuff like spreading lies to incite riots toward staff) and therefore we need to understand what and how we want to actually proceed.
• Smallest of the things, Staff members being volunteers and therefore having like 3 hours available today, maybe 6 tomorrow and maybe only 1 the next day.
  Teerav was a moderation staff member in the past, you can ask him about the activity time, where there are people who can just handle 2 hours a day, which seems a lot but is not.

 

But lets go down and make an example of a really problematic case, making a GM one for example, which is probably the most known complaint:
 

Example: 
PlayerA starts to sell their account goods in change of real-life money (EUR/USD just to give an example). He sells 500.000 pokedollars and 9 pokemon to 10 different users.

• Yes, what just described looks incredibly messed up, however that's how 95% of the RMT cases are.
  In this case what we do in the first place is banning all the seller accounts (obviously) and then start to check all his trade logs of all his accounts from A to Z (even past one that might be 1 year before the RMT happened) to find every single user he sold the items to, and the trades that looks suspicious and investigate them.
  
  Now that we handled the seller, it's time for the buyers. Who bought from PlayerA(seller) is potentially involved in other RMTs, we cannot know until we find. So GM will go and check all the trade logs of the buyers cause maybe the buyer decided to move the bought goods on his alt accounts to hide them.
  Now lets suppose that the buyer has 3 accounts, this means that GM will have to go and check all the trades and connections in those 3 accounts where maybe the user did hundred trades in his game-life.
  Multiply that for the 10 different buyers and each buyer has 2-3 accounts (even if, as staff, most of the rmters have even more than 3-4), this means you will have to check all the trades and connections of 25-35 accounts (seller included).
  
  In the end, during the appeal, the user will be asked to be honest and cooperative and we will have to verify everything he says with the data we obtained. We are pretty kind during appeals, to my opinion, to the point where people deny even speedhacking despite they do that in front of other 50 players and get reported by 10 of them but we still give them more chances to be honest so we can offer them another chance to play with their account.
  
  Few months ago, our GMs found a mass RMTer group that had sold more than 800 millions pokedollars in total and the account to check were more than 155, which takes even more than a week.

 

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If a player trust or not a staff member, it really does not mean the staff member is actually unprofessional or handle the case wrongly. 

The only times where a staff member is not allowed to handle a punishment is when the said staff member is the one being involved. For example, is someone start to say "Keita is a [hecking] retarded idiot", I will not handle it myself but pass it to someone else.

Here below the evidence:

 

 

Really important as well that the reason you are not able to pick another MOD to handle your appeal is exactly what you have done, Belzebel, by playing the staff roulette and showing how much abusive that can be.

1. You first were unsatisfied with Qeight;
2. So you came to me (Keita/Shinohara), which was fine to a certain point despite Qeight did not abuse power or punished you wrongly (and 10 different admins from 2018, period Qeight joined, until now can confirm you that, Red/Sugar/Mage/Arkos/Eaty-Walross/Shaolan-Cames/Fluffles/Xylos/Shinohara/Logan/, so I don't understand why you say different unless you think all of us are blind).
3. After that you were even unsatisfied with me (for the ban with the viadinho), which in the future evolved even in starting trashtalking me as well using as well racist terms and spreading lies about me (we'll get to this point later), therefore Walross talked to you about your behaviour (you were still in staff).
4. After Walross,  months later, in order to explain you the OnlyFans and what was wrong with having it in our community, Ehkoe intervened to help (both as your friend and as well as staff) and talk to you.

 

All of this in the last year of course (2020), however if we consider even before than 2020 then more than 8 different staff members handled your punishments, and you always complained about them.

Also, that number without counting all the one that actually warned you within the staff about your behaviour issues like you jumping within discussions about PVP (when we were still deciding it within staff and had not a council) and calling brainless people that had a different opinion than you and then calling them sexist after they asked you nicely and kind to refrain from coming out of nowhere and start insulting or disrespecting people calling them brainless for using a specific pvp style, as that's unnecessary and not productive.

Just leaving a little part of it here, to give context, but not gonna go further as it's unneeded and the aim is not shaming or similar but just explaining that a lot of the things you see are just reaction after the  staff team (not only qeight) just is not able to absorb unjustified insults and hate anymore.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

I mean, you were the first staff member in history that needed to be muted on the staff discord due to the continuous insults toward other staff.

 

In no mean this is meant to insult you, obviously, but what you always did and shown was that you just played the Staff Roulette and looked for a staff member who actually agree with your vision and not a staff member who handle your case fairly and justly as it's correct to be. 

 

As for the appeal that was locked, it was not locked immediately but you were given an accurate explanation on why you were banned, shown you evidences as well of when you got warned about the topic (warned before the ban, out of kindness, so you had time to not commit that infraction anymore despite you had already more than 15 in total).

You however tried to force a change of MOD and ignore the appeal itself, despite as I explained above it's just not possible to change MOD for the reason mentioned above plus the fact of how you abused that "want a different mod" system or the complaint in general about who was banning you/the bans you were receiving from different people.

Appeal was therefore locked in the moment you were not cooperative and just pretended us to once again do what you want.

 

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No, staff member are not allowed to call others idiot. But, at the same time, players are not allowed to do the same.

Please, refer to this post I made before for some extra detail about the first part: HERE (Written by Shinohara) and HERE (written by Walross)  and then keep reading here.

 

Qeight/Felix way of addressing the whole hate toward him has been wrong as he used a wrong language, but he reached a point where I think that he's totally right in being really mad about the way he's being treated. 

You specially Belzebel throw a lot of hate toward staff, and this is easy to prove just by watching your videos where not only spread lies and trashtalk but also target people (despite you complained in the past where some player did it with you).

I will literally make an easy example here about it.

 

In the past, in a private discord, I mentioned not being a fan of onlyfans and I preferred it not existing for various reasons (I still think it like that and will add reasons below), and stating that's different, in my opinion, than a porn actor/ess career. Reasons for that thought are literally these (as stated as well to a friend I talked with few days ago):

 

However, you literally took my statement about it should not exists and transformed it into:

 

Put into a Google Doc and sent it into a guild discord with more than 2500 users inside. (and later said google doc/screenshot went around the community)

All of this is honestly cringe and sad.

Also, bias behaviour for the onlyfans ban (discussing your patreon that contains +18 material and even send a warn when you open it)? You were talked by 3 people before getting banned, exactly cause it could have been prevented, but you just ignored and kept doing it..

 

Lets add as well the fact that, as a person who cared about you in the past, I tried to stop you in 35 different ways from breaking rules even to the point of dedicating you 12 hours in a row to talk with you about explaining you the situation, how you were breaking the rules and how to actually behave and report taunts/provocation from other players without answering to them.

As you were ignoring me and keep breaking rules (and since discussing with you when you have a different opinion is just close to be impossible), I just tried to approach Teerav so he could have probably helped you better in understanding that you were just once punishment away from the permanent ban (where banning is something that no staff, and specially me, like doing).

 

I didn't talk to teerav with any bad intention, specially since I never had a bad intention within the PRO related environments.

I do this with the community in general, and I can prove it as I have done to you in PM.

Last week, a user was starting to break rules and getting worse, so what I did was asking to a friend of this person (within staff) to actually talk to him and block him before it would have gotten to far so we could have both fixed the situation before it was gonna be too late and avoided a ban, since ban sucks specially in situation they can be prevented.

 

However, about it, what did you do? Made this piece of art and spread it.

Included this into your google doc and spread that into a community with 2500 PRO players, which later got shared around.

This not only is racist for obvious reason (it clearly is as you are using my nationality to judge me) "Japanese sexist culture", regardless the fact you called "sexist" over than 20 staff members even when you were a staff member simply cause they told you to remain respectful if you wanted to participate in discussions and you were replying "Oh yeah, I am a woman so I have to shut up cause I am an object... you are sexist", despite no one ever said anything even minimally close to that (and there were other women in the discussion) but people just asked you to not insult people with a different mindset.

 

Which was followed by further spread of hate:

 

So, in short, no staff should be allowed to behave like this but recently the frustration shown and verbal abuse is literally a result of not being able to absorb anymore all of this hate based on lies and false things.

 

Small mention to the fact on how you created us hundred hours of work by saying in your video by calling it HOW TO GET UNBANNED saying that all the banned people should go and appeal again mentioning they felt humiliated by staff. Despite they had already appealed and complained already in the past, and I mention past cause you made people spam that stuff in more than 300 people all with the same copy paste message you passed them that had already their case solved and complain reviewed and handled by one of the admin/leader in the last 4 years.

 

This is just the tip of the iceberg obviously, but this is not the place aimed at pointing out everything unless further spread of lies are done where it will be necessary to point out any false-accuse and just say the truth done to avoid people being innocently being put in the bad light.

The same happen with players obviously, which is why I had no problems in mentioning Rise (a former staff member we kicked) who damaged players by power abusing.

 

In my eyes there is not just black or white, regardless if it's player or staff, truth is necessary and the spreading of lies and false accusation to put people in a bad light is just wrong.

 

I will also make you other examples here below to make you understand what I mean with player unjustified hate.

As I mentioned them in another post, I  will simply put them in a spoiler so they are easier to close for the one who read them already:

  Reveal hidden contents

1. Example one.
   Few months ago there was a really big group of Real Money Traders that in total were actually selling (obviously not from a single account but many) around 900.000.000 Pokedollars (900 millions).
   Said staff member found it and banned all of them, both the seller and the buyer exactly as it is correct to be since Real Money Trading is a really serious infraction that can potentially destroy the game economy.
   This group was from a single specific country and a few of the banned went to complain to a PRO Youtuber they were following saying they were unjustly banned and the staff member was racist.
   This Youtuber started publicly accusing the staff member of racism and banning innocents, which has lead the story to get bigger and bigger until this person and staff (admins) started to receive threats from many users supporting that youtuber and thinking what said was true.
   
   Now, unfortunately, we cannot address these things publicly cause it's sort of unprofessional to call out people in front of everyone.
   However, the staff member called "idiot" or "stupid" (I don't remember which one of them) that person who did their best to put people against the staff who issued the punishment.
   Was it correct to call them stupid/idiot? Honestly not correct and not even worth the staff member time.
   However, we are humans and therefore get tilted as well when we experience such things. Does it justify any disrespect? Absolutely not, but that's exactly to say that things are never just black or white and there are many things that cannot be seen by a lot of users but users just assume that the staff his doing everything alone and starting it.
   
   
    
2. Example two.
   We have a user who was able to reach the total amount of mutes necessary to get permanently banned. This number is exactly 8.
   In short, this user, a pvp player, was being toxic against opponents every time he had the chance to (mocking them or their skill after beating them, insulting them after this user was losing, etc)
   Every mute the user was receiving he was making an appeal, where he was promising to not be toxic anymore and follow rules/respect other players.
   However, after not even a month it was back to the start with the user being toxic again.
   Time passes and mute by mute the user reaches his 8 mute and then the permanent ban as the limit was reached and crossed.
   User at that point appeal, as he was permanently banned, and ask for a final chance. The staff member believes him and his words and decides to give him a last chance, however giving him a long mute despite the unban (this is how policy works after you get out from a permanent ban, having reached the limit, for toxicity).
   The user really happy accept it, a mute of 250 days aimed at making him reform and chill.
   
   The 250 days of mute passes, the user played without any problem until then. However, after the mute ends, not even a month later the user was back again being toxic, insulting after losing and mocking players after winning. This lasted for months, he continued doing it for months until we checked chat log and people started reporting him.
   At that point, the staff members decide to issue the last permanent ban as it was clear that the user could not get reformed.
   In that way we lost a PRO veteran player, and it sucks but at the same time we cannot give a special treatment to people only cause they are old players.
   
   We had initially thought about having him playing with a permanent mute, however the limit was already reached and honestly it would have been unfair toward all the players (new and old) that this user had insulted and mocked until now.
   Lets be clear, there are players that know they are toxic and therefore ask us (before getting punished) to kindly mute them so they are chill and can play without any concern. In fact, we appreciate that, as player realize they can't control themselves and want to play without causing problems.
   
   Anyway, after that person was banned, he started to try to put an entire community (the community of his country) against staff, even going as far as saying that if he will find that staff member he will stab him with a knife and kill him.
   In that way we got a big community from a country against us for something that staff had no fault with.
   
    
3. Example three, and last one.
   Long story short, during Summer Tournament 2019 the user winning the gold tournament had cheated the whole tournament by making someone else playing for him. Host were me and that staff member.
   That staff member realized something was wrong and pushed for a investigation which has lead to the user being called racist by that person and spreading the fact he was racist for doing that check. (user was trying to defend himself and play the racist card to block the investigation)
   Also, that person had a relative within the staff team that also pushed and promoted the "you are racist" card. (this is explained better later).
   
   Unfortunately, time passes and we cannot find anything solid about it  (we ban only after solid evidences) so we just close the investigation.
   Few months later, this group of people have a discussion and stop being friends so they start to report each other. It was then that we found evidences about it, as they literally reported the whole tournament situation where, sadly, the staff member (the relative mentioned above) also helped in cheating the tournament and hiding it.
   
   Needless to say, the staff member was kicked and the user got their first prize removed.
   However staff got once again a big amount of people hating staff and that staff member despite nothing wrong was done on our end, but people just blindly believed their friend.

 

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Already addressed this Staff Roulette above and how much abusive it can be.

Action will be taken only if the staff member is directly involved in the case (e.g If you in-game insult me, I cannot ban and handle the case and I have given example above) or they abused power (in that case will be removed if there are evidences to support that claim, since we don't punish someone only cause player says stuff but is not able to prove it and on our logs everything is fine) or they have misused power or treated the banned user wrongly due to personal reasons or similar.

 

However, none of that happened until now in the case you mentioned.

Or, if it happened, then 10 different admins (Red, Arkos, Sugar, Mage, Eaty/Walross, Shaolan/Cames, Fluffles, Xylos, me-Shinohara and Logan) from 2018 until today are totally unaware of it and I invite you to properly report it.

 

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Please, read as well the link I passed in the second part of the post HERE (Written by Shinohara) and HERE (written by Walross) cause they are important and address things that I didn't repeat just to avoid a 30 kilometre post.

 

Kind regards, 

 

- Keita

You are doing the same thing Qeight does when he wants to avoid answering questions. You talk about the players issues.

I am a player, not a staff. You can punish me all you want. However, when a staff break the rules, what do you guys do? If you like them, you defend them.

 

I'm not the only one who thinks Qeight doesn't deserve to be staff.

Taking bullet points I sent in a random discord out of context is easy to use against me. The bullets points are harsher and vague because they are for me to understand. You told me many times what happens outside of PRO platforms should be ignored. Interesting that you are bringing it here now. I see your plan.

About eliminating the staff, I'm not sure how stupid you think I am to take me serious on that one. I don't like Qeight, yes, I want him out. About you, yes, I think you are blind. I don't think you are a bad person, but you hate to be wrong. And I think that's a bad thing for an admin. Ignoring the majority of the players concern just so you can pretend to be right and play god with Qeight and the other staff hungry for power.

About Wally, I respect him. I don't agree with his impulse of doing everything on his own without discussing with the rest of the team. I was staff and I know this happened many times. If you deny it, its lost case. I give up. Other than that, I think Wally is a great dev.

 

Also, when you talked to Teerav about my "onlyfans", which I don't even have (it's actually patreon), I didn't even have it. You saw a random pic of mine that was sent in MY discord, leaked to another discord that you were in, and you already jumped to the conclusion I had Onlyfans and talked to HIM about how to deal with it, and not me. I appreciate that you were worried or whatever you wanna say, but in the chat with HIM you said how much you don't care about what I do, so being worried makes no [hecking] sense. You contradict yourself a lot. And I still don't get why not talk to ME about something that concerns ME? It simply doesn't make sense. Lemonie talked to ME about it, not Teerav.

 

But anyway, somehow, you turned this about me. We aren't talking about me. I am simply a player that does not represent staff in any way. Qeight is a staff with 2 roles. Spawn Editor and GM. GMs have a big impact in the image of a game. Its legit called Game Master. Someone with poor behavior representing staff... why does that sound familiar? Oh wait! Reminds me the reason I got kicked from staff! Interesting how this doesn't happen to the GM, but the most active artist can get fucked! I love your logic. How do you not want me to feel like you are bias? If Q8 is allowed to call players idiot and legit have 70% of the community not respect him as staff because of HIS OWN ACTIONS, and I can be banned simply because I was annoying INSIDE PRO staff discord? Players didn't even noticed me. This just shows you guys don't care about how the players feel, but how staff feels.

 

Sadly, I am not in mentioned discords anymore to show you the screenshots. But I'm pretty sure @teeravand @Smooge have evidence. If they have the balls to get involved and risk getting their accounts banned, well... I appreciate. I already know how bad staff wants me to be permabanned. But, I'm not scared. That will just prove the dictatorship isn't just something I created in my mind.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Belzebel

[Shinohara]

On 6/25/2021 at 1:15 AM, DRDoctor said:

Based take for everyone thinking to respond or this might get deleted before you read it, this is a fan made pokemon game not a democracy. Your vote doesn't matter and your opinion doesn't either. You can't change someone's online presence by complaining or reacting negatively. I get its 2021 but that's your based take from me. 

 

I think the biggest misconception that exists within the community is how complaints, votes and number works.

Everyone opinion matter and is important, no one excluded, as long as it's forwarded with respect.

 

However,  there are few things to mentions:

• Accepting, respecting and valuing a lot an opinion doesn't mean that you have to agree with it. 
• Numbers of how many suggest or vote for something doesn't matter. What matter is the content of the suggestion/complaint and the arguments provided.
• What direction the DEVs want the game to take is really important.

 

Number of opinions and value of them

Regarding the number, it's easy to make an example about it. if 300 people says "Ban Charizard." and then one person comes out will say "I think Charizard should be banned due to X reason, Z reason, Y reason and here below you can find all the data I have collected to support my argument." (I think Jorogumo does it greatly tbh) we will value that single person feedback in a higher and better way than the others.

And let me clarify that English is not the reason of why 98% of people actually is unable to give a productive and constructive argument/feedback/opinion.

 

Why? Is that person special?

Absolutely no, simply that person is providing a constructive and productive argument supported by data, meanwhile the other 300 people saying "Ban Charizard." are providing pretty much nothing and are unable to even properly give a constructive and productive argument.

 

 

Accepting&Respecting an opinion doesn't mean agreeing with it

Exactly what title say. This is not understood by many people and sometimes they (not everyone obviously but a portion of them) try to force their vision within the game and try to force us to do what they want.

This is wrong, and should not happen in any way. Being annoyed by an update is perfectly fine, however in not a single game I played the community can force the staff to do what they want.

At most, if the community see that the direction the game is taking (decided by DEVs, considering as well community feedback of course) is not the one they like and that it won't change for now, then they are able to leave the game or take a break to see how the new update will turn out to be(all of us played a game and then left it later).

[Saintebaguette]

12 minutes ago, Shinohara said:

Accepting&Respecting an opinion doesn't mean agreeing with it

Exactly what title say. This is not understood by many people and sometimes they (not everyone obviously but a portion of them) try to force their vision within the game and try to force us to do what they want.

This is wrong, and should not happen in any way. Being annoyed by an update is perfectly fine, however in not a single game I played the community can force the staff to do what they want.

World of Warcraft, the community made the whole staff change Feral Druid multiple times, by just saying it's unbalanced/broken,
Made Rogue Assassination skill be removed since the rogue could basically stay areal forever as long as he does the proper rotation
Made Mage Frost damage getting lower since it was giving slow/freeze + high dps
Made Death knight Blood lose it's worms that made it immortal.
Reduced paladin Bubble CD time, etc..

Tera  the community made the staff correct the scythe class because was dealing too much damage with minimum effort + life leech
Made the staff nerf the Lancer damage output, since it was purely an immortal tank with infinite mitigation and high damage on pvp.

Overwatch, everytime the community makes the staff change damage/ CD of certain charactes that are unbalanced

Elders Scrolls Online every Wednesday they fix unbalancing, add community chosen items that were removed, remove updates that got a negative feedback.

Those are 4 of the greatest MMORPGs ever made, of a staff that listen to the community feedback, all those games have 6 years + and they manage to attract the player base every time by listening to the community.

 

[Belzebel]

Here's some example of staff being immature and defending each other even when called out.

 

Teerav quotes what Felix/Qeight said in one of the threads he made himself, implying he doesn't care about players criticism since he worked hard in his spawn editor work. If you have 1 braincell functioning, you understand he is quoting what Felix said in his thread, and not talking about his spawn editor work.

 

This is how Felix responds, and other staves gather to defend him and insult Teerav.

Felix didn't give a heck about what Teerav said, but he cared to call him stupid. What an example of staff behaviour.

Then, Piine, another staff, completely miss the topic, spin it around to try to make Teerav sound stupid.

Moderation and Spawn Editor are different roles, yes. However, no one said they are the same. Being a GM and being able to ban and handle appeals, gives you the same powers of a Moderator and more. And yes, Qeight is a GM. 

Then he follows to mention he was a Coordinator and expected him to not be clouded. So... basically, they didn't give attention to the actual quote Teerav mentioned. They rather insult him, like a 14 year old kid. If one thing is cringe, its this Keita.

They clearly don't accept criticism, and they are the only ones allow to insult players.

 

Oh, and btw, these were screenshots taken from the actual PROs discord, not any random private discord. A discord that actually concerns staff and the game. I wish you did the same when you want to expose me and [heck]. But well, staff has the power to do anything they want, right?

Edited June 28, 2021 by Belzebel

[Sir]

22 hours ago, Shinohara said:

 

Ehi there @Sir

 

I have actually checked the case and I can confirm that there are signs of boosting there, visible from the several matches against another account logging from your same house (same connection and IP) in a really short time (same hour), adding as well the fact that you won all of them.
 

In total transparency, I think that the staff member handling it was a bit too much harsh (without absolutely any bad intent as the staff is one who always supported and stood by community side), although this was partially a consequence of you lying entirely or partially. 
It just looks however that you have not yet wrote a complaint about it in order to have a review about the case, but what you(or your brother) did after the appeal was just starting to insult the staff handling it.

 

I will in any case invite you to make an official complaint here so we'll go back on the case: General Complaint Area.

 

 

Kind regards,

 

- Keita

hello there

thank you for responding

i have a lot of respect to you and to the administrators of the game and i would like to express my thanks on behalf of the players for the effort you put into keeping the game clean from cheaters but..

 

with all respect i cant trust that my case well be handled fairly in General Complaint Area  and you will know why if you continue reading .. there is a different between misunderstanding and lying is like the different between the sky and the earth! .. and i would like to invite you and the mods and all the players who comment in this post to join us to make a fair judgment .. now lets get back to what happened months ago to make things clear

 

1- me and my brother and our friend (our neighbor) we all using the same network

2- we have 2 pc's (one i use it alone) and the other one used by my brother and our friend

3-my only account name is (stug) .. my brother account name (scorpionaz) our friend account name (gandaf) and to make things clear we all use one account each so there is no alt account

4-the story: it was the mid of the season (maybe late .. cant remember now cuz its been along time) what happen is i was playing pvp in the same time my friend (gandaf) was playing so we met in a match and i told him in that time that i want him to get out of the game cuz i dont want to match him and i dont want to lose cuz i was in a guild (and he wasn't) so he did disconnected but after maybe 1h or less we met again but that time i matched him in a fair way like i match any other player and i won .. now i dare the staff who called me liar to bring the match video and show it to any 5 years old kid and he will tell you there is no cheating .. it was a fair match i won and i got punished for wining imagine that! and what was the punishment? .. banning my account forever!!

5- in the end of the season i loged into my account and got that shocking message telling me that my account is banned so i tried to contact the mods and here novus came and started to accused me with cheating and lying and he claimed that i have more than one account without showing any evidence! and when i tried to defend my self by providing evidence that we are 3 different persons and no cheating or boosting there .. he closed the appeal!!!

 

now i want all of you to pay attention to these points under

 

1- the appeal took so long like 2-3 days and i was waiting for hours to get responds from the mod

2-the mod didn't gave me any chance to defend my self by closing the appeal even if i was so gentle with him in the whole appeal

3-my friend tried to appeal and he got the same respond from the same mod (novus)

4-in my old account (stug) the one who got banned i had like 3000h of plying and zero warning .. yes yes not a single warning cuz i always make sure that every thing goes right and clean

5-i tried to contact Shinohara many times in private and didn't get any respond

6-what kind of person that risk his 3000h account to get 10 or 20 point in rating! .. that is just madness

 

after all this you read .. i dont think any one can blame me for insulting the mod after what he did and how he handle the situation but here i am in public apologizing for my behavior at that moment cuz i was so angry from him

 

in the end i know i might get a punishment for publishing my story and thats why i dont trust the publishing my story in General Complaint Area cuz i tried so many times to get justice without any interest from the mods but anyway people also have the right to know the truth and the truth is i got banned just for winning in pvp game not for cheating and not for lying

 

regards 

[Orihara]

2 hours ago, Belzebel said:

 

I'm not really one to take sides since i believe both parties are wrong with their approach. However, i dont think false information is necessarily the way to go with things.
First of all lets take a look at what teerav says "Classic PRO GM attitude" While that post is about Spawns. Being a GM has hardly have to do anything with it, in that regard thats hardly a valid criticism to be taken into context.
As for felix, his attitude is wrong and he knows that, hence why  he was issued a warning from Keita. Staff have their own policies to follow on behavior, rulebreak etc, i know because i made them. Just because his behaviour is not acceptable doesnt mean staff will ignore those policies and out-right kick him.

And yes, Moderation and Spawn editing has nothing to do with eachother, the only common ground they have is felix having both roles.

As for general feedback, attacking someone personally is not a valid feedback, nor will it pressure someone into reverting or adjusting changes, it will only backfire because in itself, it is a rulebreak to harass a staff member excessively, now if we take into consideration that barely anyone has recieved a punishment despite calling quite despicable things, it disproves the so called "abusive attitude" being angry does not absolve anyone from following rules. period. Staff or player alike.
 

Edited June 28, 2021 by Orihara

[Belzebel]

15 hours ago, Orihara said:

I'm not really one to take sides since i believe both parties are wrong with their approach. However, i dont think false information is necessarily the way to go with things.
First of all lets take a look at what teerav says "Classic PRO GM attitude" While that post is about Spawns. Being a GM has hardly have to do anything with it, in that regard thats hardly a valid criticism to be taken into context.
As for felix, his attitude is wrong and he knows that, hence why  he was issued a warning from Keita. Staff have their own policies to follow on behavior, rulebreak etc, i know because i made them. Just because his behaviour is not acceptable doesnt mean staff will ignore those policies and out-right kick him.

And yes, Moderation and Spawn editing has nothing to do with eachother, the only common ground they have is felix having both roles.

As for general feedback, attacking someone personally is not a valid feedback, nor will it pressure someone into reverting or adjusting changes, it will only backfire because in itself, it is a rulebreak to harass a staff member excessively, now if we take into consideration that barely anyone has recieved a punishment despite calling quite despicable things, it disproves the so called "abusive attitude" being angry does not absolve anyone from following rules. period. Staff or player alike.
 

I don't think you get it. The comment Teerav made has NOTHING to do with his spawn editor work. Teerav wasn't talking about his WORK, he was talking about what Felix SAID, and as a staff, it just looks pathetic. I wasn't attacking anyone personally. All I did was ask a few questions and criticize the behaviour of some staff. Thats literally the purpose of this thread. Keita replied SOME of the questions, not all of them, with examples that have nothing to do with what I was talking about. Then, out of nowhere, started posting screenshots of something that happened in a private discord. He just decided to flip the table on me for no reason. I topic is about staff, then he talks about me. Wtf? I don't have the right to criticize just because I have an outside content that he doesn't like? Or because I was banned before? It is easy to be banned when the staff don't like you and watch you like a babysitter, taunting you to do or say something wrong so they have an excuse to ban you, specially when you can control the rules and don't need to provide evidence of any [heck] to justify someones bans. Even worse when the same person who banned you handles your [hecking] appeal. 

 

Just to clarify in case I didn't express myself well. I'm not saying I don't deserve my bans. I'm aware of my toxic behaviour. What I'm saying is, it is easy to be banned when I'm targeted by literally everyone. Because I have a youtube channel and I'm pretty known in the community, people try to get my attention in many ways. Poking and taunting me is one of the ways. When I show screenshots to staff of players insulting me, they ignore it until I respond back so they can have an excuse to punish me and the players, sometimes only me.

This is an example:

I log in, ask for help, someone calls me cringe. I ignore it, someone else tells me to "fakaf", invading filter.

Someone else asks what I need help with, the one who calls me cringe calls him simp.

This happens ALL the time. I admit, I'm not very good at controlling myself towards taunts, but I do ignore them a lot. Sometimes, tho, specially on my period, I will respond back.

Im pretty sure staff didn't do anything about the ones taunting me. But if I responded back, they would appear real quick.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Belzebel

[Thatkid]

Guys, calm down. Damn.

[Belzebel]

They say Qeight was warned for his immature behavior, but I don't see improvement.

A GM allowing irrelevant posts like this that are here clearly to mock players taking this thread serious, and reacting with an emoji that supports it.

If Keita really warned him like it was said, he clearly didn't learn his lesson. He will only get really punished when he provokes staff, and he knows it. Provoking players and behaving like a 10 year old is allowed if you are a staff. Pathetic.