Idkup

A tale of Gyarados and a bunch of rats that don't care about exp, basically Time to clear (Kanto): approx 7 hours Time to clear (Johto): approx 5 hours + half an hour farming money in Kanto to prepare Time to clear (Hoenn): approx 8 hours Kanto: Final team: Pewter: Cerulean: Vermillion: Celadon: Fuchsia: Saffron: Cinnabar: Viridian: Indigo1: Johto: Violet: Azalea: Goldenrod: Ecruteak: Cianwood: Olivine: Mahogany: Blackthorn: Indigo2: Hoenn: Rustboro: Dewford: Mauville: Lavaridge: Petalburg: Fortree: Mossdeep: Sootopolis: Ever Grande: Bugs: There is a bug where switching after a KO sometimes sends in a Pokemon that has previously fainted rather than the correct Pokemon. There was one instance where levelling up in a trainer battle did not yield an evolution prompt after the battle. Multiple movement tiles now calculate at the same time and result in the player moving diagonally; the vectors seem to be summed. Overall Thoughts: There is nowhere near enough EXP to not play like a total rat, but Pokemon is an easy game where you can abuse a number of multipliers and interesting game mechanics to win for free. Early to mid game felt fine, but lategame EXP is about a fifth of what it should be and became very noticeable after Saffron. The traditional grinding spot in Victory Road yields approximately 1000-2000 EXP per battle, which is frankly a joke. This level of difficulty is fun for me because it allows me to justify abusing the AI with Sturdy + Rocks + Thunder Wave + Flash + Intimidate + Eerie Impulse into +6 into win, but is not realistic for casual play whatsoever. People cannot be expected to relog four times against Giovanni's Mewtwo for a full paralysis turn to Curse with a level 20 Gastly and trivialize the fight. The EXP share is great QOL and let me level Electrode from approximately 20 to the 40-45 I needed while clearing Victory Road without extra pain. The EXP bar also seems to be a little quicker, which is nice. I do appreciate the ability to evolve in general as looking forward to these power-spikes is part of the charm of the genre. Overall, just fix mid-late game EXP and it would be a lot better. Some routes in Johto have level 15 wild spawns and level 40+ trainers, further exacerbating the situation and effectively creating a limited EXP pool in the region. The clear would not have been possible (without a painful grind) without bringing the single copy of the Swords Dance TM available in Kanto and picking Totodile to abuse Surf + Ice Beam + Dig earlygame and Swords Dance + Agility + Ice Fang + Earthquake lategame to bypass the deficiency in raw stats and levels. Also, Feraligatr sucks in comparison to Gyarados, and switching out and setting up approximately four times for a Smokescreen miss from a certain Skuntank was not very fun. There is significantly more EXP available in Hoenn, though it is not enough, and does not redeem the region in any way whatsoever. I was evidently happy to consign the memories of the atrocious Jackson-Magma-Aqua storyline to an abyss where I'd never have to contemplate it again, but... the entire region's story should be looked at for a rework. The sheer amount of backtracking and unnecessarily repetitive combat against grunts that pose no real threat while simultaneously draining resources (on this rework, you are perennially underlevelled if you care about your sanity) is an unreasonable chore. Mt. Pyre in particular no longer fits with the apparent design philosophy of the current team - after all, the trainers there can still be skipped using the relog exploit, indicating they weren't touched in recent reworks - as a device where previous Scripters evidently hoped to bore players to uninstall. Similarly, the monotony of the three raids on the Weather Institute, Magma Hideout, Aqua Hideout, and Seafloor Cavern fulfill no real gameplay purpose, and many areas simply have too many trainers for no reason. The difficulty curve in general is also completely out of sorts - Deoxys is capable of wiping a team; Brawly, Wattson, Norman, and Winona are significantly threatening... while the final two gyms fall over to a Masquerain 20 levels behind curve and the Elite Four is an utter joke. Regarding the subject at hand, it's likely possible to raise 3 Pokemon with all the trainer battles available in the region, but it would be quite a painful experience. The EXP Share was sufficient for keeping Electrode and Masquerain serving their respective purposes to allow for Quiver Dance + Baton Pass to make up for Swampert's lack of raw stats.

I think it would be for the best if the use of event forms was dialed back. In recent years, events have come with well over a dozen new forms of varying quality - some amazing, and some that leave the player befuddled as to how they were approved - a certain grinch-bear comes to mind. At the same time, it has become evident that the amount of aesthetic resources allocated to supporting new maps and stories has dwindled. For example, Alto Mare reuses tiles meant for the Airship from the Legendary Bird questline, while the levers and steam clouds in the Christmas dungeon look ever-so-slightly out of place. No doubt this lack of flexibility frustrates those working on maps, and by extension, those looking for new ideas to script and implement into the game. I understand that this may be difficult with available resources or even downright impossible. However, if it is an option, I would certainly like to see an area with a new palette over yet more forms. I apologize if this post is off-topic.

And yet just one year before that it would have seemed perfectly natural. This place is weird.

you forget there are people on both sides of the screen. the people complaining about prehax have said much worse to others. i get you want to stick it to "the man" but that doesn't exist in this situation. staff have zero incentive or requirement to hold themselves to a higher standard when speaking casually. people simultaneously treat staff with ridiculous deference while complaining about staff egos they inflate themselves. id say that players should treat staff like other players but frankly a not insignificant amount of this community treats other people terribly, so i guess ill just say that everyone should be respectful but not deferential to each other, regardless of whether or not that person is staff. would go a long way towards bridging that gap.

flaming people isn't a healthy way to vent go outside :]

thats fine but my point is this thread has gone off the rails disproportionately targeting q8 when theres real problems that affect players a lot more than prehax being mean

if these are true you guys should really take issue with the staff issuing those bans because i think we all agree they're ridiculous and indefensible, no?

good luck getting someone banned because they called you stupid

just rename this topic to prehax hate thread already y'all ask for more communication from staff, he communicates his opinions and doesn't veil them behind diplomatic language - is this not the transparency people ask for? his dismissiveness of opinions he doesnt agree with is the primary issue between staff and players? please. not everyone is good at putting on a fake smile and lying to your face that they'll "think about it." makes perfect sense why others avoid interacting with this community like the plague. good riddance.

start

Clefable according to this thread:

ik we talked about this in DM but I really feel that both Lati twins being ranked below mons like Bisharp, Weavile, and Zapdos is a massive travesty and makes no sense - Scarf Tyranitar is not common enough to keep them from being by far the best Keldeo answers for teams that care about tempo - Latios's draco meteor is an insane special nuke and Latias has more utility than 95% of the tier. Alakazam-M (51% on-paper 2hkos) and Medicham-M (mediocre speed tier, garbage bulk) are both overrated imo, Diancie is better than them in general with 110 speed tier + unique typing + magic bounce, but we talked about this as well. just wanted to post my thoughts to maybe start some discussion

gold; no comment bonus: [HP GRASS]

Player name: idkup Showdown name: idkup Server: Gold Timezone: GMT-5 Rank on ladder: 14

just do 11 years of solaceon, 50% chance you'll get a playable thundurus from it

So: - Rerolls are currently always in demand, because "elite" players want "epic" legendaries. - Rerolls will remain always in demand if it is reasonable to obtain decent legendaries. Instead of the ultra-rich spending 844 rerolls on an HP Ice Thundurus that may or may not appear, more average players will spend 10 or 20 rerolls to obtain playable legendaries, which is something that is currently out of their reach. Rich players will reroll more niche legendaries for experimentation - think of all the Kyurem and Moltres rotting in players' boxes right now. Are they bad Pokemon? Not necessarily, but the current system makes it more or less impossible to justify spending rerolls improving their stats. More reasonable numbers will only increase demand, not reduce it.

Reroll tickets currently sell for ~750k. If we assess the value of a playable legendary at 10M, it is only worth spending 13.3 rerolls on a legendary at their current price. As the numbers in this post demonstrate, that investment is not likely to yield a playable legendary. This shows that rerolls are currently priced based on their scarcity, not their value - I would expect little (if any) change in price if rerolls are buffed or other ways of improving legendary stats are introduced.

Much has been said about how annoying and expensive it is to reroll your legendary Pokemon. With the amount of powerful legendary Pokemon being released, this is a bigger problem than ever before. It is currently difficult to imagine a properly constructed PvP team without at least one legendary - the likes of Landorus-T, Tornadus-T, Thundurus, Manaphy, and Mega Diancie simply have no comparable huntable replacement. Because of this, I would like to present a mathematical analysis on how difficult it is to obtain a legendary that is able to function in its role - having sufficient speed to maintain its speed tier, and the correct hidden power if necessary. I will only look for average secondary stats (HP, offenses, defenses >= 15). These statistics were computed using a script that simulates rerolling a legendary over and over until it meets certain parameters. This was posted in the PvP forum as it is most relevant to PvP players. First, let's consider this (admittedly subjective) list of essential legendaries: Essential: Niche: Let's consider only the 10 legendaries listed as essential. Here are the speed IVs they must meet to remain in their speed tier: Let's take a look at how many rerolls it would take to obtain bare minimum speed, reasonable secondary stats, and Hidden Power if necessary (Mean | Median # rerolls necessary in 10,000 simulations rounded to nearest integer): Sum total: 1877 mean / 1305 median reroll tickets needed for simply playable stats. Source code can be provided if anyone is interested in double-checking my work, but arithmetic will show that these numbers are reasonable. I think no one will disagree when I say this is unrealistic for the vast majority of the playerbase. Of course, the primary offender is Hidden Power, but I would consider these numbers unacceptable even without the [Ice] electrics. As frustrating as it is for players, I can't imagine it's profitable for the game, either - with these numbers most players simply won't bother rerolling, weakening the economy. My best suggestion for mitigating this issue is allowing players to grind to increase their legendaries' IVs up to a maximum of 15. I'd love to hear any alternative ideas. As an aside, this forum needs actual moderation. The Greninja thread was a cesspool of low-effort posts and blatant misinformation - Keita eventually closed it, but ideally we would be able to engage in productive discussion without these sorts of distractions.

why is anyone even talking about unpredictability greninja only needs 4 moves to be beyond broken it should always be running 3 of those 4 moves any other set is hard trolling and makes greninja look balanced Greninja @ Life Orb Ability: Protean Timid Nature 252 SpA 252 Spe 4 Def - Ice Beam - Hydro Pump - Spikes - Extrasensory / Hidden Power Grass anything you need other coverage to hit you can just spikestack on, the only defoggers allowed to play the game are mantine, spdef mew, and empoleon (lol) i dont think i need to explain why stacking spikes on a mon with infinite offensive pressure is broken asf

YEP 100% BALANCED no need for any action i havent played pokemon in months, dont ban gren mawile please i need my free rating

Spikes.

I agree with the bulk of this post, but I do not think the slight additional bulk of Impish Garchomp (which still has no recovery) ever justifies running this set over a corresponding Jolly set with an appropriate speed tier. Most of your suggested changes have been implemented. As for Bold Manaphy, I think the set needs to see some more experimentation. I tried 252 HP Timid CM Manaphy a while back in full stall and it was reasonably functional, but I'm not convinced it's better than Suicune.

Changelog 6/30/2020: As I have been actively laddering this season, this update is rather large. A lot of Pokemon's rankings have been shifted downward, D rank has been removed, and C rank's definition has been clarified. Here is the full log of changes: rotom-wash -> A+ tornadus-t -> A+ azumarill -> A bisharp -> A chansey -> A ferrothorn: relaxed / sassy garchomp: jolly / naive gengar -> A greninja -> S heatran: timid / calm / modest landorus-i -> A gliscor -> A+ magnezone -> A- serperior -> A- tangrowth -> A+ togekiss -> A- breloom: jolly / adamant hippowdon -> B+ hydreigon -> B+ infernape -> B kommo-o -> B+ skarmory -> B+ suicune -> B+ thundurus-t -> B+ azelf -> B conkeldurr -> B- entei -> B heracross: jolly / adamant -> B nidoking -> B salamence -> B scolipede -> B staraptor -> B starmie -> B aerodactyl -> C+ alakazam -> C+ chandelure -> B+ gyarados -> B- darmanitan -> C+ jellicent -> C+ kabutops: jolly / adamant krookodile -> C mantine -> C milotic -> C- slowbro -> B arcanine -> C- empoleon -> C gastrodon: sassy / relaxed -> B- gligar -> UNR jolteon -> C- haxorus -> C- machamp -> UNR medicham -> C omastar -> C nidoqueen -> C- porygon-z -> UNR tyrantrum -> C venomoth -> C- venusaur -> B- articuno -> C- blissey -> C- florges -> C- gardevoir -> C- mienshao -> UNR stoutland -> C- whimsicott -> C- flygon -> UNR mesprit -> UNR noivern -> UNR scrafty -> UNR torkoal -> B- weezing -> UNR cradily -> UNR donphan -> UNR emboar -> UNR exeggutor-alolan -> UNR gallade -> UNR honchkrow -> UNR lanturn -> UNR magmortar -> UNR marowak -> UNR miltank -> UNR qwilfish -> C- ninetales -> UNR rhyperior -> UNR rotom-mow -> UNR sableye -> UNR sandslash-alolan -> C- sharpedo -> UNR shaymin -> C- slowking -> C- snorlax -> UNR victreebel-> UNR yanmega -> UNR poliwrath -> C- It would take ages to explain all of these changes, so I'll go over a select few. Rotom-Wash -> A+ Rotom-W is as good as ever, but it is not on the same level as the two Pokemon that now occupy S-rank. Tornadus-T -> A+ I underestimated how unreliable Hurricane is. Tornadus-T is still great, but it cannot function as a sole check to the wide variety of threats it covers in theory. Chansey -> A, Skarmory -> B+, et al. Stall is no longer the strongest archetype in the game. The onslaught of new threats has made its life a little more difficult. Gengar -> A Gengar faces stiff competition from Greninja and Tornadus-Therian, which can fill similar attacking roles while providing much more utility to the team. Greninja -> S This Pokemon is broken and should have been banned two years ago. Greninja has scarce few answers for its massive attacking movepool. When faced with these answers, it can simply set Spikes on the switch and proceed to get out. Hidden Power Grass and Ice Beam allow Greninja to deny every relevant Defog user in the game (sorry Mantine and Empoleon), which makes it very effective at keeping Spikes up, unlike most other users of the move. This quality allows it to tear down defensive teams by itself - the amount of Ferrothorn, Heatran, and even Chansey that I've been able to smash with Specs Latios's Psychic thanks to Spikes pressure from Greninja has been absolutely absurd. When playing Spikes Greninja, there is no need for a dedicated stallbreaker. Simply keeping up offensive pressure is sufficient. As for why I didn't come to this conclusion earlier? For a decent amount of time, I considered Gunk Shot necessary on Greninja. As nice as the coverage is, it does not deal with Rotom-Wash, one of the most prominent Defog users in the game - allowing it to remove Spikes set by Greninja fairly reliably - resulting in no progress being made by the Greninja player. Hidden Power Grass removes this issue entirely (Grass Knot cannot be used due to its pitiful base power against Rotom). Proper handling of its weakness to priority is also of utmost importance - I tried to fit Greninja on extremely offensive teams that already tend to struggle against priority. With these issues resolved, Greninja is a terrifying force - an offensive Pokemon with an excellent speed tier, no true answers, and the ability to destroy defensive teams on its own. Landorus-I -> A As much as people want this Pokemon banned, it's frankly just a worse Greninja. Its lower speed tier is not made up for by its marginally increased breaking power, while Greninja's Ice Beam is a much more spammable attack than Landorus's Earth Power. Stealth Rock is better than Spikes, but also has many more viable users. If Greninja is enough to demolish stall, there is not as much of a need for a slower option which is considerably worse against offense. Gliscor -> A+ Gliscor is incredibly easy to fit on virtually any team. With the correct set, it can handle a number of top-tier threats for any team - Bisharp, Clefable, Gengar, Heatran, et al. It is never the best counter for something, but its durability allows it to serve as a fairly solid check. Poison Heal and the ability to stallbreak with Taunt set it apart from Landorus-T.

"really big and unfair advantage" No. Just no. Half the ladder playerbase knows what my teams are and it doesn't really matter, because anyone with the skill to pose a challenge would have extrapolated likely sets to a point where they can play accurately by Team Preview. In fact, it's almost easier to deal with someone that knows your team, because they will often think linearly rather than completely. No one on ladder is going to bother to directly counterteam a single player. If you see a Volcarona paired with two solid Heatran answers, it's probably not Hidden Power Ground. With regard to the suggestion at large, it seems infeasible because of the difficulty it would impose on moderation. Anonymity also makes people bolder in the face of rules, which would be a further negative impact on a community that can be somewhat toxic already. Regarding being "exposed" on Youtube: Everyone loses. So what? -1

Unless you're playing Aurora Veil (RIP Baton Pass) or other one-dimensional hyper-offense builds, this is utterly and dangerously untrue. Unless your team is so aggressive that your gameplan is the same every game (just kill everything lol), regardless of your opponent's decisions, you have to interact with your opponent. This renders it necessary to adjust your strategy in response to your opponent, which usually means calculating lines to a depth of at least 3 turns - easily taking at least 30 seconds to consider just reasonable options.