denied Suggestion: Nature MS(GMS)

[Freddyftw]

the only way to make this idea convenient for everyone without making it too OP and without affecting too much on the negative aspects indicated so far, is to make sure that this GMS does not tell you the nature of the pokemon but only tells you if your synch has worked or not. Let's assume for example Scyther: it can be played in many ways. If GMS tells you the nature, you could abuse all synch fail as well. If, on the other hand, you are looking for adamant and your synch fails you can decide not to take it, even if maybe it could be one of the other useful natures.

[Gatso]

+1

[Iceflake]

On 4/14/2022 at 8:33 PM, FreddyFTW said:

the only way to make this idea convenient for everyone without making it too OP and without affecting too much on the negative aspects indicated so far, is to make sure that this GMS does not tell you the nature of the pokemon but only tells you if your synch has worked or not

This is honestly the same thing.  Also writing this as my last post wasn't as fleshed out.  Still a -1 from me.

Scenario 1: GMS saying if sync worked and what nature.

 You encounter a Bulbasaur with a bold sync.  "GMS Sync has worked to Bold!" You get a Bold Bulbasaur.

 

Scenario 2: GMS just telling you it worked.
You encounter a Bulbasaur with a bold sync.  "GMS Sync Worked!" You get a Bold Bulbasuar

Scenario 3: GMS working and stating the nature of the pokemon.
You encounter a Bulbasaur with a bold sync.  "GMS Failed, Lax Natured!" You wouldn't catch it as then you would just be wasting a pokeball.  Only with specific pokemon that could use multiple natures {like Swablu for example) Benifit greatly for it and is seen as overpowered.

Scenario 4: GMS failing and not telling the nature
You encounter a Bulbasaur with a bold sync.  "GMS Failed!" You would just run away.  If sync failed then that means its a very lower probability that you will roll into the nature you wanted.

As you see it makes no difference either way, you will always catch it if it works even if it tells you the nature or you just don't catch it since it doesn't sync.  The only outlier is 3 but for very few pokemon.

 

Hunting by far is one of PROs best money sinks in the game {imo}, giving players the option to always see what they are getting{even if its backhanded} will be bad in the long term.   It seems like a minor change but it completely changes the hunting format.  It changes the fundamental rules of pokemon.  {not counting gen 8 since with gen 8 pretty much everything goes.}



 

Spoiler

There are ways of finding out if a pokemon is +speed natured by just using slower pokemon than a {insert pokemon name here} with a iv above a certain threshold at the level they spawn.  It just takes time.

 

[Aditya118]

@iceflake

2 hours ago, iceflake said:

Hunting by far is one of PROs best money sinks in the game {imo}, giving players the option to always see what they are getting{even if its backhanded} will be bad in the long term.   It seems like a minor change but it completely changes the hunting format.  It changes the fundamental rules of pokemon.

  Reveal hidden contents

There are ways of finding out if a pokemon is +speed natured by just using slower pokemon than a {insert pokemon name here} with a iv above a certain threshold at the level they spawn.  It just takes time.

 

 

Then what about BMS? It boosts the encounter rate of h.a even the h.a means hidden ability , so it should be very rare and not common or uncommon+ you will be using trace poke and that's where it changes the hunting format; you also talked about "it will be bad in the long term and changes the fundamental rule of pokemon" but thats what the BMS is doing...

 

And see GMS just tells if your sync worked or not(we can still get fails like low IVs) +we can catch other pokes we encountered with correct nature if we failed the sync as stated above by FreddyFTW. And it can cost higher than BMS as Electrocute4u stated it would be OP, so it would be purchased not so often. Also if you are worrying about pokeball's economy, then read Envymeister's & Pity's post. 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Aditya118

[Aditya118]

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[Aditya118]

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[Aditya118]

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hoping reply from developer...

[G3n3r4l]

On 4/16/2022 at 2:03 AM, Aditya118 said:

@iceflake

 

Then what about BMS? It boosts the encounter rate of h.a even the h.a means hidden ability , so it should be very rare and not common or uncommon+ you will be using trace poke and that's where it changes the hunting format; you also talked about "it will be bad in the long term and changes the fundamental rule of pokemon" but thats what the BMS is doing...

 

Thing is BMS is still only a boosted to 25% chance, it doesn't flat out tell you that you got a hidden ability poke, trace does, an ability from a pokemon. I don't know the exact statistics of it, but I'd be curious to know how many people actually use a trace poke for hunting. Your idea, is that it directly tells you whether or not your sync worked, which is just overpowered, i won't go into details as Iceflake summed it up already. Sync is already a 50% chance, which is as balanced as balanced can get, adding more onto that just makes the chances better. Adding a percentage booster would also be just as OP for the same reasons. Something like that would have to cost significantly more as it would at that point almost be guaranteed to get exactly what nature you want.

[Bash]

13 hours ago, g3n3r4l said:

 

Thing is BMS is still only a boosted to 25% chance, it doesn't flat out tell you that you got a hidden ability poke, trace does, an ability from a pokemon. I don't know the exact statistics of it, but I'd be curious to know how many people actually use a trace poke for hunting. Your idea, is that it directly tells you whether or not your sync worked, which is just overpowered, i won't go into details as Iceflake summed it up already. Sync is already a 50% chance, which is as balanced as balanced can get, adding more onto that just makes the chances better. Adding a percentage booster would also be just as OP for the same reasons. Something like that would have to cost significantly more as it would at that point almost be guaranteed to get exactly what nature you want.

I'd love to see you going into details. 
Because I wouldnt just disagree with Iceflakes arguments, I think the key ones are wrong too - at least for those you can count as arguments.

How is that so obviosly overpowered, am I missing something? Im totally fine when ppl say that they dont like it for whatever personal preferences, but not when they use 'arguments' which are no arguments.

 

 

I want to summarize what iceflake wrote so far, as it summarizes your opinion too and give my input on it.

 

Iceflake said:

Quote

This would just make hunting just to easy.  A 50% sync chance is just fine enough.

I think we all agree that this is just a statement, not an argument yet.

 

Quote

This basically removes the 50% chance.  You wouldn't have to waste money/pokeballs to catch pokemon without the desired nature.  This is something That would be unhealthy imo.

This is smt like an argument. We wouldnt waste money/pokeballs anymore as we are good hunters and dont catch Sassy Froakies.

 

However, I responded with:

 

Quote

Lets say you hunt at a spot where you see a Pokemon that matches your sync all 10 minutes. Half of them are syncfailed. Means you see a syncfailed Pokemon all 20 minutes. That means, when you need in average 5 Pokeballs, you save up 3k Pokédollat in one hour. When you hunt 20h a day this would be 60k. 
When a GMS costs 100k for a day, the GMS would actually be a better money sink.
 

+ You get Pokeballs cheaper when you buy them in bunch, same for ultra balls. Battle bot even gives you sometimes like 40 Ultra balls or so iirc

As you see I showed on a very simple example that there would be no op money sink you would dodge. Infact, depending how you balance the prize of the GMS, its even a better money sink. 

 

Next post Iceflake makes 4 szenarios to show that it makes no big difference if the nature is shown or not, if its not for Pokemon like Swablu. 
- Ok. Nothing I can say against. 

The more interesting part is:
 

Quote

Hunting by far is one of PROs best money sinks in the game {imo}, giving players the option to always see what they are getting{even if its backhanded} will be bad in the long term.   It seems like a minor change but it completely changes the hunting format.  It changes the fundamental rules of pokemon.  {not counting gen 8 since with gen 8 pretty much everything goes.}

 

Its stated that hunting is one of the best money sinks in the game (as an opinion).
This is, ngl, a weird statement, as hunting is one of the best ways to generate money in PRO. Its no sink when you go out with an plus. Buying stuff in order to hunt is a sink - that is what is meant I guess. The GMS wont affect repels, but it does on Pokeballs.

But, to that stuff I already wrote a passage. Once you read that passage I wrote, there is no way you can have still the 'opinion' that the GMS would lower the money sink.
Unless you calc the stuff more exact, maybe with real data, different thoughts I may have not included and come to an different result. I didnt made a very realistic calc, I did it even pretty sloppy  since I was kinda sure about the outcome.

 

 

Quote

 Sync is already a 50% chance, which is as balanced as balanced can get, adding more onto that just makes the chances better. Adding a percentage booster would also be just as OP for the same reasons.

To this part. I can't understand the first sentence. Why is it as balanced as it can get? Is 49.45% not balanced anymore? What about 55%, is that to much? What about 50% but a way lower encounter rate? How can you see that 50% is as balanced as it can get? (Is it even 50%?! More about that in the next quote)

 

*adding more onto that just makes the chances better*
Yes, indeed. The chances are still the same tho

The difference between a percentage booster and a GMS like thing is actually huge as the GMS barely touches the time you need in order to catch a good Pokemon while a percentage booster, for example 100%, halfes the time to find a good one.
If there was a GMS in the game, there wouldnt be more epics than before. Even less how it seems

 

Im not 100% sure how syncs in PRO work - if they work as in the originals or not. I always had the fact in the head that they dont work like in the originals. If they do, this guy has a good point too:

Quote

And when the 50% fails, you get a random nature out of a possible 25. So the total chance for the specific nature is 0.5+(0.5*0.04) = 0.52.

If there was a GMS that tells you if a sync did work or not, and we assume you only catch those where it worked, your total 'good nature' catches sink by 2% as the 'random nature encounter' falls off. Which brings us back to the point of if it makes a difference if the GMS states just if the sync worked or not, or if it tells you the nature.

 

 

My conclusion is still: You dont have to make the GMS very expansive to make it 
a) Attractive to be bought
b) To be an even bigger money sink than buying Pokeballs

 

 

 

[Aditya118]

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